Kathy Shaidle guest blogging over at Small dead animal.
In other news: Pope calls "Peace Train" "self-indulgent, second rate"
"In an interview with BBC television, [Cat Stevens] said that he went to a Catholic school, ‘so at one point I used to believe that the Pope was infallible.’
"But he added that the pope’s comments on Islam showed he was fallible, ‘because of the kind of interpretation he had of Islam, he should read Gandhi and find out what he said about Islam,’ the singer said, adding that the Indian leader had a more peaceful interpretation of the faith."
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Wow, that must’ve been some craptastic Catholic school, because, as everyone else learned in, like, grade 4, the Pope is only infallible when speaking ex cathedra on matters of faith and morals.
But I guess those big words confounded the man behind such profound compositions as "Wild World".
As for Gandhi, I for one have always been way more interested in what he said about daily enemas as the path to enlightenment, sleeping with naked teenage girls, and how Jews should let Hitler kill them.
But I’m funny like that.
I do keep waiting for him to update some of his old classics like "Hard Headed Inman", "Spanish Peace Train Bombing", "But I might die tonight (if my suicide belt works properly)", or "Crecentshadow" In fact if you read some of the lyrics of the original Moonshadow they do have a suicide bomber bent. Such as:
And if I ever lose my hands…
And if I ever lose my eyes.., And if I ever lose my legs,
And if I ever lose my mouth, all my teeth, north and south,
Well I am all for his losing his mouth part.
18 comments
Yeah, because the Catholics have ohh so much room to lecture Muslims about the use of violence to promote their religion. Please, Al-Qaeda has nothing on the Catholic Ustashi in terms of body count or brutality. Plus, nobody is rushing to make OBL’s supporters the Islamic equivilent of saints (assuming they have one), like Catholics are with Stepinac or Pius XII
He need only stand up and look behind himself to find his mouth. A common affliction among the unenlightened.
Ummm…what exactly did Ghandi say about sleeping with naked teenage girls?
I pray that Blessed Pope Pius XII be recognized as a saint soon. I am sick to tears of idiots with an ax to grind and not the slightest interest in truth dragging a great man’s name through the mud.
It would please me to see us take a stance and force his detractors to put up or shut up then crawl back into their hole under the bridge and cuddle up to their Jack Chick comic collection.
Please, go down to NARA II and look at the records in RG 319 boxes 107 or 142, where the OSS document the assistance given to the Ustashi by Pius XII, who met with Pavelic twice, despite his well established reputation as a terrorist.
OK hoodlum,
ZF010183 lists Ustashi, but I can’t get into it.
By the way,
I’m travelling, so this may go on for awhile.
‘Bat’ Stevens?
Gandhi, he aint just for breakfast anymore.
(ok, I was in ‘bat’ Steven’s world for a second)
I wonder why Hoodlum is even bothering. If he would have us believe he is defending Islam then his appeal to 20th century Jewish oppression is specious at best but most likely a disingenuous ploy.
However, if his intention is to blast Catholicism (and not defend Islam), we can be certain that he is not a practicing Jew as most Jews who go to temple know about Pius XII and revere him for the hero he is.
Of course the most likely reason Hoodlum decided to show up here to today is that he is yet another culturally illiterate Secularite showing up once again to voice his incredibly uninformed opinion regarding the Catholicism and its central role in creating Western civilization.
So, to sum up, there are four reasons for Hoodlum to grace us with his presence:
1) Angry Muslim who wants to tell off us dumb Catholics
2) Angry Jew who wants to tell off us dumb Catholics
3) Angry Secularite who wants to tell off us dumb Catholics
4) or Dumb Catholic
If 1 is the case, he is a fool who has never cracked the cover of a history book. But Muslims are known for having no interest in debate — especially when it concerns religion (unless you consider beheading an appropriate response in debate).
2) Cannot be the case because Pius XII has been canonized among Jews before Catholics could (the process is much more slow and formal for Catholics).
If 3 is the case, he is a fool who has never cracked the cover of a history book. (By the way, Secularite includes an apostate of any religious tradition).
If 4 is the case, he is a fool who has never cracked the cover of a history book. Ahhh, Catholic education at its finest! But uninterested Catholics tend not to troll orthodox Catholic blogs and if they do, then they would be too overcome with shame (SHAME!) at what bad Catholics they are.
Therefore, he is most likely 3 and, if the 20th century is any indication, his views are highly destructive socially and politically (as Secularist views are wont to be). Recommended course of action: snicker snag.
Stubble,
looking at some other sites, I’m thinking:
5) Orthadox Serb.
I think Hoodlum is a dumb atheist who believes any crackpot theory that is advanced on the Internet (assuming it is properly anti-Catholic, of course).
I believe that Cromwell advanced this calumny in his book, “Hitler’s Pope” and it has been thoroughly repudicated by Rabbi Rychlak’s (that’s right, “Rabbi”) book, “The Myth of Hitler’s Pope.”
I praise God every day for people of integrity like Rabbi Rychlak who, although they may not share the Catholic faith, at least make a serious attempt to find out what the truth is before they start spreading slanderous allegations.
Too bad there are so many people who, the minute they find some alleged “dirt” on someone with whom they are not ideologically aligned, they can’t wait to spread it as far as they can.
No matter where he is now, Cat Stevens was quite an artist and seeker of God in his most expressive years. “Catch Bull at Four” and “Numbers” particlarly evidenced his quest. That doesn’t make him an expert theologian, obviously.There are plenty of musicians who inspire us to wonder about God and man. I think it’s good to be thankful for their gifts and ok to be a little embarassed for them when they overreach.
Actually, Yugoslavia is my area of experise, so the odds are I’ve cracked a few more books on the topic than any of the readers here.
Also, notice what I told you to read. I never mentioned Hitler’s pope because it’s not very good. What I specifically told you to look at were the United States Army files relating to the pursuit of Ustashi leaders in the post Second World War period. If you go read them, you’ll find a 9/1947 CIC memo detailing why they US decided not to arrest Ante Pavelic
�PAVELIC’s contacts are so high and his present position is so compromising to the VATICAN, that any extradition of Subject would deal a staggering blow to the Roman Catholic Church.�
My source? �Memorandum for the Officer in Charge, Subject- Ante Pavelic, 9/12/1947� RG 319, US Army Personal Name Files, Box 173, Folder XE 001109, NARA II
What did Pius XII do about this? Nothing, even though Mr. Pavelic made use of his summer residence. Nor did Pius XII assist in bring Archbishops Saric or Rozman to justice despite their open support of the Quisling regimes in their country.
Nor did he or Stepinac publicly condemned the Ustashi massacres, which is pretty bad given the Nazis and Italians took active measures to stop them.
And let us not forget the Franciscans. While Father Kolbe gets most of the press, his Croatian cohorts were busy giving orders to, “go and slaughter all Serbs, and first of all slaughter my sister, who is married to a Serb, and then kill all the Serbs in a row”
Besides, if Pius XII was truly innocent and good, why does Vatican hide its files from WWII? AFter all, he has nothing to hide, right?
Anyway, this history lesson is over. If you’d like to learn more you got my email address.
The wonderful thing about conspiracy theories is that a little faith can take you a long way. Whenever you are confronted with evidence to the contrary, you dismiss it as part of the disinformation movement of the large, inimical organization in question (the Church, the NSA, CIA, Republicans, pharmaceuticals, Letter People, etc).
People who believe these theories usually have something at stake. For me, in my UFO-conspiracy days, it was a desire to find greater meaning in my Secularist existence. I was assured the information existed: was told about the Kennedy film that shows the driver shooting Kennedy, the documents proving the Bush family used oil rigs to run drugs into America, and the secret plan to hunt down those who knew the “truth”.
Why was I so eager to believe? Because these things all affirmed my own Liberal, pro-choice, pro-gay rights, anti-government, and anti-religious beliefs and the real world does not affirm such hooey naturally.
But do not get me wrong, Hoodlum, I am not saying the documents you have uncovered are not true or authentic — only that they do not matter. Even Schindler (Catholic) was on the Nazi payroll. Showing me a document detailing some connection between the Nazis and Rome would only confirm the degree in which Pope Pius XII engaged in subterfuge to save innocent lives thus further strengthening the views I already hold. That’s my wily and good pope for you!
Which (in my empathy) I know you believe is pure insanity but the fact of the matter is that this pope saved more Jews from slaughter than all the other concerted and underground movements combined (and this includes Schindler’s list) and you would have us believe that this most successful of operations was a COVER for a more sinister plot to KILL Jews?
??????
Pu-lease, Hoodwink, who do you take us for? You’d have better luck trying to convince me of the tooth fairy.
As far as the damnable “implication” quote you present, so what? You could say similar things about anyone working under deep cover. We all know complex situations are not readily understood, especially through narrow lenses like a single sheet of paper; how much more so then the complex situation which involves deception and cloak-and-dagger politics!
The pathetic thing is that even though you came in with both barrels blazing, you are all sound and fury signifying nothing. Thank you for highjacking this CAT STEVENS thread to inflict us with your pet conspiracy theory. Why not just write a book that nobody will read and get it off your chest once and for all?
I hope the shame of realizing how this thing (which has obviously consumed much of your time) will cause you to engage in some real hard self-criticism and soul-searching. May I suggest you take up a more productive (and less Satanic) hobby like sewing?
You could make hoods.
“Stubble,
looking at some other sites, I’m thinking:
5) Orthadox Serb.”
Yeah, I was playing the odds. Next down on my list would have been Mormon, then Scientologist, etc…
Uhh spark, read the date on my citation, it was 1947. The war was over, the Ustashi had been beaten by Tito’s brave communists, and the Jews did not need to be saved.
What needed to be saved were the Catholic Ustashi, which according to the US Army CIC, British intelligence, and more importantly, the Ustashi themselves, got away with Vatican assistance.
But maybe all those people got together to make Pius XII look bad 60 years in the future.
Also, my religion is irrelevant here. I am merely someone who despises stupidity and hypocrisy
Hoodlum, please do not think yourself unique among humanity because you dislike stupidity and hypocrisy. In fact, I wish you happy hunting in your crusade. In a fallen world, you will never run short of worthy targets (the most worthy of which are the Secularists whose bloody smear across human history you seem to have some knowledge of).
Despite your recent apologetics, my points still stand. You claim a pope infamous for risking his life to save hundreds of thousands of Jews went out of his way to subject helpless innocents to the Ustashi. Pius XII is accused of supporting the German Socialist Party (which turned out to be the Nazis) because they were originally seen as a counterbalance to the Communists — a party which massacres (present tense intended because of the PRC) Catholics wholesale.
Now you would have us believe he deliberately set loose the hounds on Serbs, Jews, Byzantine Catholics and others?
I am not sure Nerf brand silver bullets will do the trick. No one is going to hear your rant and say “ah-hah! So Pius (or, by bigoted extension all Catholics) was/were evil after all!”
But I really respect the fact that you had the prescience not to use Cornwell’s book as well. It says something about your integrity that you would refrain from quoting from a widely debunked work that even the author has recanted. It says a lot that you would engage in investigative journalism to discover the truth. There are so few real good journalists these days and I hope your zeal is one day rewarded with real story and not this red herring.
And if yellow journalism is your true calling, here is a tip: there is no shock value in trying to shame someone who has been exonerated of a wide-spread scandal. People will remember having been fed lies and will not be as open to yet again launch calumnious attacks against said victim of misinformation.
You need a new target — someone whose past is better concealed. This is why hacks like Dan Brown focus on spy organizations and historical persons (Secularites are known for their historical ignorance and thus make for great dupes for such conspiracies).
Finally, what about the holocaust that is going on right now? What about the fact that one out of four people in my generation were killed in the womb? Everyday in this country 6,674 innocent people are killed. That is more than two and a half times the number killed on 9/11. What about the well-documented fact Planned Parenthood introduced the Eugenics which it pioneered to Hitler? What about the fact that abortion mills to this very day target ethnic and racial minorities? What about the fact the abortion industry pulls in huge profit off of other people’s misery as well as our tax dollars? Why is this massacre not even mentioned in the MSM?
You are a good kid, Hoodlum, but to be frank my policy is not to bait trolls and I have humored your wacko conspiracy with more respect that they deserve for far too long.
I wish you great health and a shiny mirror for your soul.
“Hard Headed Inman”
What??!